IT'S A GAS, GAS, GAS!!
MESSAGE BOARD ARCHIVES/WEEKLY ROCK POLL POST
Return to Gasx3/Poll Post Board Homepage
Name: pluto
E-Mail:
Subject: RE: RE: RE: RE: BJ
Date: Thursday, November 15, 2018
Time: 5:29:03 AM
Remote Address: 80.42.100.131
Message ID: 318702
Parent ID: 318688
Thread ID: 318661
I think the problem with giving a bald 0-10 rating scale, is there is no definition of what a 0 or a 10 or everything in between, might be. So everybody might have something totally different in mind when they rate Jones .
I went with a 0 meaning tone deaf (if there is such a thing), someone who wouldn't recognise a stave if it jumped up and bit them on the arse, to a 10 being what I, with my limited knowledge and ability, regard as someone who has demonstrated in their body of work that they have a huge grasp of the theory of music, and all the elements that make up music, and who in their work, have demonstrated this to a very high degree. Usually such people have enormous technical ability on an instrument(s) as well.
On the basis that I've chosen to rate musicianship, I think if I gave Brian Jones a 10 then I would be placing him in the same bracket ability wise as say, Beethoven as a composer, or putting his playing on a par with someone like say Peter Donohoe, whom I was lucky enough to hear perform Rachmaninov
(Rachmaninoff, if you like) piano concerto's. I think if I made that claim for Jones then I might be running the risk of severely embarrassing myself.
I think it would be a dis-service to the memory of Jones to overestimate his abilities, in the same way that many do him a dis-service by underestimating what he brought to not just the Stones, but to popular music in the sixties. Some people seem to have forgotten his role almost completely.
I think to suggest that Jones had mastery over the array of instruments that he tried his hand at, is somewhat erroneous. Mastery of most instruments requires years of focused and repeated practice, under the best tutelage available. By way of illustration; such is the level of musical and technical challenge in some of the above mentioned Rachmaninov piano pieces, that a concert pianist wouldn't attempt them without at least a decade's practice under the aforementioned tuition. Jones didn't have anything like that on one instrument let alone the range that he had a go at.
All of what Jones played on any instrument was what a first year student at any music academy would be expected to play without difficulty. Of course, a lot of the instruments Jones chose to have a go at would not be first instruments, or instruments required for entrance exams or audition. That is neither here nor there, as there will no doubt be players of varying ability right up to virtuoso, who would play what Jones played on those instruments, without difficulty.
The work that Brian Jones is most well known for is simple counterpoint, and straight five or six single note repeated phrases. Prominent examples might be found in his marimba playing on 'UMT' or recorder playing on 'Ruby Tuesday', his guitar line on 'The Last Time', and his sitar line on 'PIB' which is in essence, doubling the main guitar line.
Just on the sitar; it is true that it has numerous strings, but in actual fact only a handful are fretted, the rest are essentially drone or sympathetic strings. If some Indian masters took a jaundiced view of Jones' efforts on the sitar, it was no doubt in part, because it didn't in any way show what the instrument would be capable of in their hands. Others, like Ananda Shankar, saw an opportunity, and played western pop hits on an instrument developed in a totally different tradition. Played by guys like Shankar you do start to hear just what the instrument can do.
I think non players are perhaps overawed when they see the list of instruments that Brian Jones had a go on. I think experienced players not so much, because probably playing on a number of instruments themselves, they would realise that anyone with musical ability and aptitude (which Jones had plenty of), would be able to get something (pretty quickly by all accounts, in Jones' case) from the instruments Jones introduced to pop. I still maintain that Jones' major talent was his ability to recognise the sounds different instruments made, and where he might be able to fit those sounds in. This was at a time when Jones was probably looking for ways to continue as the band moved away from the 'blues'. Of course that brief period in the sixties was a time of great experimentation in pop, and Jones with his ability was a prominent figure in all of that. As I've already said, it was his imagination which resulted in the little musical motifs, that were in large part, responsible for raising the Stones above most others in the field.
I take your point about lyrics Keno, you don't have to be able to play anything to write a song. Of course Jones could play an instrument, and then some. I'm guessing that if he had had the ability to write songs then he would have composed on the guitar or piano. What would have interested me would have been to hear what Jones would have done with his songs re instrumentation etc., either within the small ensemble of the band or perhaps in the use of other players from outwith as well.
I have never heard Jones' film score for 'A Degree of Murder' in it's entirety, and I think the only way I could judge Jones' ability in that field would be to hear the soundtrack in it's proper setting i.e. along with the film. I've been told the film is rank rotten (well, it does have Anita Pallenberg starring), and Jones' music is all it has going for it. I will try to get the movie, and have a listen for myself. I'm not expecting John Williams or Quincy Jones though, but neither am I expecting something totally not in keeping with what is on the screen.
I think on reflection I perhaps gave Jones too high a score, but because I'm biased in his favour I think I will leave things as they are i.e. a 7. I think if the question had been to rate Jones as a pop/ rock musician then I might have scored more highly.
Anyway, those are my views/opinions.
Btw Keno, I guarantee I could have you playing a tune on the kazoo within ten seconds......and I wouldn't even take my usual fee lol.
Note: Do not hit the "Post Message" button more than once, even if it is taking a long time to post your message. Doing so may cause a double post to appear and could slow down your posting time even more.
Download your free, customizable Burton Networks Message Board now!
© 1998 - 2022 by Keno Internet Services, except where otherwise noted. All rights reserved.